ITW Jérémie Daclin

The dean of French skateboarding, known for his various entrepreneurial projects and his desire to defend French skateboarding, spoke in this long interview. We discussed about his skateboarding carreer, his avant-garde shop All Access, the launch and then the end of Cliché and his new projects with Film Trucks and Bonjour Urethane. We met in his offices in Wall Street – a detail which is important – in the morning, because doing the interview at noon was out of the question! Because every day, at this time, Jérémie skates during his skate breaks.

How are you doing Jeremy?

Well, great, the weather is nice!

How did you get into skateboarding?

It’s been a very long time – Laughs -. Like many people, one day I saw a guy coming in with a skateboard and I was immediately hooked. For me, it was the freedom of being able to move around and discover my city. Thanks to skateboarding, I also did my first trips.

Was it in Lyon?

Yes. I have always lived in Lyon, because geographically, the location is quite central. The city is rather calm and at the same time dynamic. Switzerland and Italy are next door. You can go to Paris or Montpellier for the day.

When did you realize you were good at skateboarding and could make a living at it?

At the very beginning of the 80s, there were very few people skateboarding in Lyon, or even in France, so it was very difficult to plan ahead and imagine a career.
To be seen, you had to participate in competitions. I was five times French and European champion. My goal was not to participate in contests, but rather to travel and tour the world.
I rode for brands like New Deal, which was a bit like Polar at that time. I was one of the first Europeans to have tricks in an American video.

Today, all this is much more accessible, because well-established sponsors exist. Back then, there weren’t even really any skate shops, magazines or photographers. You skated mainly for the passion of skating and not thinking “I could work, become pro”. I approached this as a selfless passion at the very beginning.

Over time, I made connections, skate culture took hold and a business was born. I think it’s also a story closely linked to Cliché in a sense, since at the time, sponsorship didn’t exist. To be sponsored, you had to go to the US. Cliché was created to allow skateboarders to stay in Europe and to offer an alternative to American boards.

What was the trigger for launching Cliché?

There wasn’t really anything that clicked. I started businesses to work in skateboarding, to stay in skateboarding. I couldn’t be professional financially. It didn’t exist yet. So I had to work. I then created, first of all, a store called All Access.

I read in old interviews that it was an experimental store where you could find skate gear, buy records, attend exhibitions

It was a little too innovative for the period. But yes, we had a hybrid offer between skateboarding, hip-hop and the art gallery. We held exhibitions, we sold art objects, mixtapes, but also brands that were a bit outside of skateboarding, like Tommy Hilfiger, Ralph Lauren. I went to New York every six months to stock up on gear and clothes. Today, we call it a concept store. Looking back, I think we were a little young, and we were still very much into skateboarding. But it was a great experience and a first step in the skateboarding business.

A first experience in the skateboard business that allowed you to understand what a brand needed?

Completely. Thanks to this experience, I understood the expectations and the services that the stores needed. And then as I was skating, I also understood the expectations of skateboarders, the attention required when you are a sponsored guy, the organization of skate tours, etc.
In addition, I was the first in France to give incentive photos to riders. Depending on the photos and the appearance of the brand logo, I paid the skaters and I also paid them royalties based on the pro models.

Before that, skateboarders didn’t earn anything?

No, they promoted products for almost nothing. So it was a fair return of things. When you highlighted a logo in photos, you received incentives. Things were like this in the US. There was no reason for it to be any different here.

Was the desire to establish itself as a European company present from the start of the project or did it come later?

As a skater, since social networks didn’t exist, to make friends, even discover new spots, learn new tricks, you had to see the country. So, very early on, I traveled, traveled a lot even. I have been to Switzerland, Italy, Germany, almost everywhere in Europe many times. It allowed me to get to know people, make contacts with distributors, build relationships with skateboarders, etc. So I immediately set up a European team.

How was the shift from European brand to international brand made? Initially, if I remember correctly, the team was essentially French and European. In the Europa, there was JJ Rousseau, Pontus Alv, Ricardo Fonseca, Vincent Bressol – whose pro board I had received as a Christmas present – then, later, Andrew Brophy, Pete Eldridge, etc.

I have a little anecdote about Vincent Bressol. Vincent was on the team and at the same time a sales representative. At the time, this function didn’t really exist yet in skateboarding. One day, I suggested that he makes some extra money by becoming a representative for Cliché. He would take his car and then, between two skate sessions in Paris – that’s where he mainly filmed – he would go to the stores to show the products. In return, I gave him ten percent of the sales. He was the first sales representative of Cliché and one of the first ones in skateboarding.

To come back to your question, Lyon attracted a lot of skateboarders at that time and we also traveled a lot. In doing so, we met a lot of people who liked what we did. The shift happened naturally by creating connections.

And then we were in a rather special context. In the 2000s, international teams began to come to Europe. The Cliché Europa and éS Menikmati with French Fred came out almost at the same time. In the Menikmati, a lot of tricks were filmed in Barcelona and we spent a lot of time there.

In fact, our video showed that on almost the same spots as the Menikmati, which was a big American production, unknown skateboarders could compete with the same tricks as the international pros. People realized that Europeans could be on the same level with Americans.

Was there a feeling of contempt for Americans?

No, but afterward, it’s true that before, Americans came to Europe as if they were on a conquered land. Then, little by little, we became their European cousins. Connections were made, like with the guys from Lakai/Girl and many others.

I always tried to welcome them well, to show them the spots, I also managed the hotel reservations for them. I wasn’t the one who hide spots or break them.

You were a team manager.

Yes, somewhere, even if that term didn’t really exist. It was like being an agent. Indirectly, I was an agent for a lot of skateboarders. I took care of the skaters, it created connections, the guys enjoyed it, it was cool. Everyone was a winner.

What was your role within Cliché?

I had the role of a one-man band at the beginning, because I was all alone. I had to send the packages, contact the stores, organize the tours, prepare the catalogs… Then, little by little, as I grew up, I managed to hire people. We had a graphic designer called Eric Frenay, a guy who took care of shipping, a guy who managed the international side. And then for me, it allowed me to stay with the riders. It was the best way to continue staying on top of trends, because we were also a clothing brand at the time. We offered pants, jackets, etc. It was important to be with the skaters to know what they needed. Then, with Dwindle, I took on the role of team manager. Al Boglio was more of a brand manager. He also managed the relationship with Dwindle. And Eric Frenay was in the design department.

What was one of the strongest moments of Cliché VS one of the weakest moments?

I would say the time we were awarded team of the year. All the famous riders voted on Transworld, which was the biggest media at the time. It was the first time that a European team won this title. It was quite a mark of respect.

What did you feel?

Pride and then we felt that the company had reached a milestone. We were present in Transworld and Thrasher, which were the biggest magazines at the time. We had skaters who had pro shoe models. Lucas Puig had shoes at Lakai, Cale Nuske was one of the five skaters on the éS team, JB Gillet was in the French Connection at Lakai.

I would also add in the highlights, videos like Europa, Bon Appétit, Gitan Tours, etc. The company has lived so long that people have also appropriated moments that are more memorable than others.

Speaking of Gypsy Tours, how did you get the idea to make these videos? The concept was brilliant!

It all started with Pontus Alv, who complained: “Ah, but there’s not enough money. The hotels are too crap. » I told him: “You know, when I go in tour, I slept on a piece of grass, I don’t care. Don’t complain, it’s already a huge luxury to be able to travel. One day I’ll take you on a Gypsy Tour like I did back then.” He left Cliché shortly after. So it never happened with him. One day, I told the riders: “Come to Lyon, we’re going on a tour. » And without really explaining the project to them, it happened.
It was also the debut of reality shows like Loft Story in France. It inspired me to show all the behind the scenes, because, in a skate video usually, you see 30 seconds of the trick. You don’t see what was before, nor what is after. I wanted these behind the scenes to be highlighted more than the tricks themselves.

In the weak times, how did you feel when Dwindle bought Cliché and, after a while, decided to discontinue the brand?

This is a moment where Cliché could have disappeared. There were still some good things with Dwindle. They wanted Cliché, but they gave us the freedom to stay in Lyon and manage things as we wanted. I think, for example, of Mike Carroll, when he talked about the curse of a company’s twenty years – Gino had left during Chocolate’s twenty-year anniversary –. In fact, the hardest thing for a skate brand is to last over time. At any given moment, there is a certain fashion, a certain hype, it’s easy at the beginning to be a fashionable brand. But fashion inevitably changes. For example, from slim, you will move on to baggy. A brand must know how to pass these cycles. This is the problem we encountered with Cliché.

Besides, this is what Girl and Chocolate are currently experiencing. Initially, both brands managed to influence a lot of people through their videos, graphics, etc. Unfortunately, today, the hype is not the same. And they are still too young to become legendary brands like Powell. Your strengths can become weaknesses over time.

That was the problem with Cliché: persisting while trying to stay relevant?

With Cliché, we managed it more or less well, because I always liked to take skateboarders because they skated and not because of their skills. We never had only tech or curved skaters. We worked to build an eclectic team. There was Javier Mendizabal who was a curve rider, JJ who was a tech, etc.
I always took skaters because they were cool and because they brought diversity to the team. There wasn’t just one style of skateboarding. That’s how we managed to stay cool too.

Coming back to Dwindle, they weren’t putting pressure on you in the direction of the brand or skateboarder recruitments? That’s what it felt like from the outside…

That’s what people think, but no, they didn’t put any pressure on us. We continued to do what we wanted.

Looking back, what was Cliché missing for the adventure to continue?

Dwindle wasn’t working very well. We were the last to arrive, so we were sacrificed.
We also lacked the desire. We had the option to continue Cliché or to stop. But Al Boglio and Eric Frenay and I had different aspirations. We preferred to stop.

How did you feel once the decision was made?

It was hard, because we went on tour with lots of guys for several years. It was a story that went beyond their skateboarding skills; they had become friends. With Lucas, Charles or Vincent, Pontus, whom I saw again recently, we maintained very strong links. It was almost like the death of a person. There are those who were able to bounce back, others less so. I continue to see some of them.

And you, personally, how did you take it?

I am rather optimistic in life. I said to myself that what we had experienced was very good. And maybe it should stop and I should try something else.

Why does Dwindle continue to sell Cliché boards?

The distributors complained, because it was the brand that worked the most in Europe. Dwindle thought maybe they had done something stupid, so they relaunched Cliché with team boards and complete boards. The boards are cheaper and there may be a bit of nostalgia behind it for those who buy them.

Cliché, Film Trucks: there seems to be a common thread between these companies that reflects a passion for photography and video. Can you tell me more?

To be a good skateboarder, you have to be in a relationship with a media, a good filmer, or a good photographer. The osmosis that forms with your filmer or photographer friend reflects on your image. You can’t be the best skateboarder in the world if you don’t have a good cameraman who films you well. Before, this was even more true, since the profession of photographer was much more valued. You were thinking with the photographer to find the right spot, the right angle, the best position for the lights, etc. In the 90s, skate photographers were really innovative when it came to aesthetics and shots. This is why I have always appreciated photography.

The same goes for video. Before, you waited a year for a video to come out. And then at the risk of sounding like an old fool, at that time, we had a common bound. Everyone could have seen the famous video, Bon Appétit, Europa, Cale Nuske’s part… Now, the profusion of videos is such that we miss certain videos. Everyone has their own viewing channel and they may not intersect. Before, everyone could have seen the cover of Transworld. Photographers like J. Grant Brittain or Fred Mortagne are legendary because they took photos that everyone saw.
Earlier, we were watching the video Violet by Stroebeck. Not everyone will see it, because in two weeks a new video will be released. Those who have seen it will have watched it once or twice, whereas in our time, we watched them twenty or thirty times. Nowadays, it’s more diffuse, we no longer have the same references.

Do you regret this period?

No, not that much, I am not at all backward-looking. I find that skateboarders today are even better, more open-minded. And then social networks give more visibility to little kids from small cities.

Let’s talk about the future, and even the present with your new company. It was quite a gamble to launch a brand of trucks while the market is saturated and above all dominated by Venture, Independent and Thunder… Did you want, like at the time of Cliché, to question this established order ?

Somehow. At first, when I launched Cliché, people thought I was crazy because of the prevailing of American brands. The same story happened with Film Trucks. Skateboarders are super happy with it, because they bring something else. On the same principle as Cliché, I offer quality products, a more attractive price, more local marketing, with more listening.

Why would I trade my Indy trucks for Film tricks. What specifically differentiates them from the competition?

First of all, it is a European company that sponsors Europeans. They are lighter, they have a very particular design. There is a part, the joint between the bushings, on the truck, which ages out prematurely when you do board slides. This is a part that I therefore reinforced. It is thicker. On the market, our truck has the strongest part, while many trucks break in this location. The trucks are also guaranteed for life. And then we are registered for the 1% for the planet program.
There is this part in the shape of a parking block which has been designed to have the smallest friction surface possible. When you do nose slides or tail slides, you have less grip.

And then, I wrote the golden ratio logo. It’s something present in nature, in works of art like the Mona Lisa and the Pyramids. It gives a bit of an esoteric feel. In the design of the trucks, I used the golden ratio, especially in the design of the curves of the truck. Painters use it, Le Corbusier uses it. It’s a little homage.

The principle of Film Trucks is also to arrive with lots of colors, collaborations with artists and signature models with the team crew. I made some with Victor Cascarigny, Bastien Marlin, and others are in preparation. The competition started to do the same.

In just a few years, you have managed to quickly establish the brand as a solid alternative. How did you manage to impose yourself?

I actually had experience with Cliché and I know what services stores needed. I ship very quickly, I make a lot of promotional items around, I offer quality stickers. This is actually something that brands no longer do too much, preferring to focus entirely on digital. Casually, stickers are very important objects that are part of the skate culture. You stick them on your board, your fridge… It’s so cool and it has to continue. I also make clothes and pants on the side. I also own a small wheel brand, Bonjour Urethane, and a small board brand, Into the Wild.

We’ll talk about your other two companies a little later. I’m having a little trouble realizing it, but how does it work to develop trucks?

The truck is the most complicated object in skateboarding to design, because, for the wheels and the boards, there are standard sizes and models. When you want to make wheels or boards, thre are wheel models and you just have to add your design.

Whereas if you really want your truck, you have to develop your molds, test them to see if they work. The development of a mold can cost around five thousand euros. I collaborated with a skateboard engineer who develops quite a few skateboard products. We designed the first samples together.

If you want a consistent truck offering, you need between five and six different sizes, plus the base mold. The initial investment is very important. I started with three sizes, then added sizes later.

Like at Cliché in the early days, are you multitasking at Film Trucks?

I manage everything, like at the start of Cliché. I handle the shipments, I have a representative who works for me called Jérôme Valette. He’s a really good guy. He has the same role as Vincent Bressol at the time. I take care of product design. I go to the factory several times. I work with a screen printer, a graphic designer, I do a bit of everything. And that’s what’s cool about skateboarding too. You get to organize videos premiers, work with guys who make music, organize skate tours, and even do accounting. I really don’t have time to be bored.
But make no mistake, it’s also a lot of work. People think it’s skating, that it’s fun, that you spend your time on Instagram. But working in skateboarding means spending eighty, even ninety percent of your time behind your computer screen dealing with tricky stuff.
People sometimes make mistakes when they want to get into the skateboarding business. A company isn’t just about coming up with a cool name, putting together a team and filming a video. You have to work every day, get up every morning, go to the office…

Between all your activities, how do you manage to find time to skate in the remaining 10%? I saw that the Skate Breaks between noon and two were very important to you. Besides, it was out of the question to do the interview at noon

Laughs – We’re a bunch of friends and we try to skate every lunchtime, because that’s when everyone is available. It comes from my travels to the United States. There, they do it at six in the morning. We don’t have the courage to skate so early.
Casually, it frees your mind to skate with your friends. You’re laughing, you know why you work. It does not have a price. Skateboarding, you can talk about it as much as you want, lots of people have theories about it, but the goal is to do it. And then it’s very important to say that it’s not a question of level, whether you’re good or not good, skateboarding is a challenge to yourself. So even a guy learning to ollie can have the same fun as a guy doing a flip on a huge gap. It is above all a battle with yourself.

Is it also important that your offices are located in the same than Wall Street shop?

It’s the perfect compromise. It’s a pleasure to come and work here and meet up with my friends. We have coffee together, we watch videos. Otherwise, on a business level, being present in a skate shop is important, because that’s where everything happens. This is where the kid must go, dream, see the boards, the equipment, attend the videos premiers. It must remain a central place. The Internet and generalists like Decathlon can kill this vital connection. Skateboarding is not just tricks, performance, it’s also a whole culture that is conveyed by skate shops, by the enthusiasts who are behind it, the people who help detect kids, who help them to be sponsored by brands. It’s a super important ecosystem and skate shops are the first link. It is for all these reasons that I am happy to share my local with Wall Street.

A link that could be threatened by Décath and online shops?

The Titus and the Skatedeluxe sell brands and the marketing that goes with it. While Decathlon sells blank boards. A virgin product is a product without a soul. And actually, what is skateboarding? When you enter a shop, you have one hundred and fifty boards. If you take away the graphics, it’s one hundred and fifty identical boards. It’s the small layer of screen printing that gives the soul of a brand. The difference between Blind and Palace comes down to this. And Decathlon is killing this culture.

However, they do offer boards with graphics created in collaboration with artists.

They make meaningless graphics. These are not graphics that defend an ideology, a team, a way of skating. In all other activities, the mountains, fishing, Décath comes in and offers virgin products – very good products in fact – at aggressive prices, but they kill all that. Skateboarding is not just a sport, it has a whole culture behind it as I said above.

You have a project for a wheels brand, Bonjour Urethane, and boards, Into The Wild Skateboards, which Bastien Regeste told me about. Can you tell me a little more?

I have had quite a few requests from distributors to make wheels. We did our first skate tour in Montpellier. The goal is to have a team, go on a tour and then offer prices a little lower than American brands. The principle of the wheels is to have a dye-free urethane. This is why they can be reminiscent of Bones wheels.
I also have a small board brand, Into The Wild Skateboards. I make my legit artist friends work like Gonz, Bryan Lotti, Chet Childress and Javier Mendizabal. The goal is to offer small series with a super finish and somewhat special shapes. Each board is unique. For me, the Shape Pops sicle, apart from the graphics, they are not very striking. While the shapes are a bit special, when you ride them, ten years later you remember them. This is also why some boards are legendary, like Powell Tony Hawk. The goal is also to offer boards that are both skateable and collectible. The Fred Gall, for example, was often ordered to be hung on the wall. The boards are available exclusively in select skate shops like ABS, here on Wall Street, at the Appart Skate Shop in Saint-Etienne. For the moment, I would like them to remain a little confidential and available in certain specialist stores.

Je lui souhaite le même succès que Film. Je ne vais pas te garder davantage, il est midi et c’est l’heure de la Skate Break.